Transcript Generated by AI 00:05 Hey, Mark Parkinson back with Park Place. 00:07 And today we got a very special episode of Let's Talk. 00:10 I think you know that Let's Talk is our expanded podcast series that we do each 00:15 month where we feature a complete superstar in the sector. 00:19 We certainly have that today and I want to thank First Quality for their 00:22 continued sponsorship of the segment and the great work that they do in the sector. 00:27 Very happy to announce that our guest today is Phil Fogg from the Marquis 00:31 Companies. 00:33 As I've traveled around the country for the last, I guess, 00:36 20 years nationally and 35 years in the sector, 00:39 I'm not sure there's a person that's more respected in our sector than Phil Fogg. 00:44 Just when you bring up Phil's name, people just continue like, Oh yeah, 00:48 Phil Fogg, he's amazing and it's for good reason. 00:51 Phil has built a remarkable company in Oregon, 00:54 a company that consistently rates as one of the top clinical providers in our 01:00 space, 26 buildings, principally in Oregon, 01:03 an overall five star score of 4.3. 01:07 And among buildings that take Medicaid, Marquis consistently rates at the top or 01:12 near the top of all the buildings across the country. 01:16 On top of that, Phil is super smart. 01:18 He's developed a whole series of ancillary companies that provide services 01:22 both to his buildings and to hundreds of other buildings. 01:26 And he's made an enormous impact on the sectors, 01:29 having served as Chair of the Oregon Healthcare Association and during my time 01:34 at AHCA, as serving as the national chair of the 01:37 American Health Care Association, where he changed us. 01:40 And we'll talk a little bit about that in the segment. 01:42 And he made us better. 01:44 If you want to figure out how to succeed in our space, 01:47 I'm not sure there's a better person to be talking with than Phil Fogg. 01:51 So Phil, welcome to Park Place and Let's Talk. 01:55 Thank you. 01:56 Thanks for all the kind words and I appreciate it. 01:59 And it's good you're out in Oregon and we see the beautiful Oregon background. 02:03 You guys are located right outside of Portland. That that's correct. 02:08 And again, thanks so much for spending time with us. 02:10 Now, Phil, I, you are a fourth generation SNF provider 02:14 and the first 5 or 10 years that I knew you, I didn't know you well, 02:19 but I did know that you were 4th generation provider. 02:23 So I just assumed that you had inherited this company from the legacy of your 02:28 parents, grandparents, etcetera. 02:32 But that's not the case at all. 02:33 You built Marquis from the ground up, starting with a single building. 02:36 So tell us about you getting into long term care and then how you got your first 02:40 building. 02:42 Yeah, sure. 02:43 You know, my great grandmother started a long term 02:46 care and frankly they were what would have been important care homes at that 02:52 time or what we would think about them today. 02:56 And then in '63-'64, when the licensure and funding came 03:01 available for skill facilities, then she started getting into that space. 03:08 And so she had a facility, Northeast Portland, 03:12 that my dad ended up one of my grandparents managed and owned. 03:17 And then my dad took it over. 03:19 And as I was growing up at from about the age of 12, during the summers, 03:24 I basically cycled through every job in a nursing facility. 03:27 So it started in the laundry and then went to the kitchen and then went to 03:31 housekeeping and I went to CNA. 03:33 And so by the time I had finished high school, 03:36 I had done all the all the jobs in a long term care facility. 03:42 I had gone to school down in California and got my healthcare administration 03:47 degree actually up in Portland. 03:50 And then immediately started working with my dad's company, which is Prestige Care, 03:56 which is no longer they've sold to PACS. 03:59 But I moved up the ranks, became an area manager, 04:03 and then I did the due diligence on a facility in Southwest Portland, 04:08 took it to the board. 04:10 At that time in Oregon, it was incredibly difficult. 04:13 The Medicaid system was bad. 04:14 We were the first state to do assisted living and we were the first state to get 04:19 a waiver. 04:20 And so the occupancies had gone from 95% down to 65%. 04:24 Bad economics, not it was not ridiculous for the board 04:28 to say we don't need another turn around. 04:32 And so I asked for the opportunity to do it, and that's where it gave us our start. 04:37 So you went to Prestige and said, hey, I found this opportunity. 04:40 They said no. 04:41 And you said, is it OK if I leave Prestige and take 04:44 this on myself? 04:44 And that first building ended up being the first building at Marquis. 04:50 And then over the years, you developed a lot more. 04:52 And we'll talk about that in a second. 04:53 But when you started, Oregon had one of the worst Medicaid 04:57 rates in the country. 04:58 And as we, you know, we featured you in the book that we put 05:02 out on the best companies in the space. 05:05 In interviewing you and your team, you indicated that was actually an 05:08 advantage. 05:09 Tell tell us about that. 05:11 Well, yeah, I, I think for me it was that because the 05:16 Medicaid rate was so bad. 05:19 I, I think we even got to be the 50th state 05:21 at some point. 05:23 It's 50th worst state. 05:25 It was it, it's what enabled a 25 year old to be 05:28 able to go in and take over buildings. 05:32 The the sellers were just handing over the keys and they were tired. 05:40 They were, they were no longer had the 05:43 capitalization and, and so I was able to go in and basically 05:47 for the most part, negotiate leases with purchase options, 05:51 guaranteed purchase options. 05:54 And, and yeah, I would have never, like today, 05:57 a 25 year old with a dollar in the bank account would never be able to start a 06:02 long compare company. 06:04 It's just completely the opposite environment. 06:05 Sometimes you have to be lucky. 06:07 I mean, Stacy and I would never have been able to 06:09 start our business in Kansas if they'd had certificate of need. 06:12 We just were lucky to be in a state that sometimes you just sort of have to be 06:16 lucky that way. 06:17 I think you've also said that because the Medicaid rate was so bad, 06:20 you learned how to watch every penny and every dollar, 06:23 which then helped when the rate got better. 06:25 That's exactly right. 06:26 I, I, you know, we had to be so careful. 06:30 And my dad had given me a quote, which is, a couple of quotes, 06:36 which was "make love to your money" which doesn't sound good, 06:41 but it's showing that cash is so important. 06:45 And his second part of that is cash is the last to go and the last to come back. 06:50 And it's so true in this profession. 06:52 It's especially true today because we, we don't have a large private pay market 06:56 in the skilled nursing facilities. 06:59 And so if you start losing money, you create negative cash flow. 07:04 It, it has a tail on when you get that 07:06 positive cash back. 07:07 So you've really got to not only manage your expenses, 07:10 but you've got to manage your, your cash and your liquidity. 07:13 And, and I, and it was it, it, it was very good for me to have to be so 07:19 close to that. 07:21 You know, I think about our administrators today 07:23 and probably 90% of the administrators in America don't worry about cash. 07:26 They don't even think about their balance sheets because that it's not their 07:30 checking account. 07:31 And it was, it was by far the best thing that could 07:33 have happened to me is to go through that period of time. 07:37 And the good news is that Oregon has now actually now become one of the best 07:41 states in the country. 07:42 You guys working with Jim Carlson and Phil Bentley and a bunch of visionary 07:45 providers, you've got one of the highest rates, 07:48 Medicaid rates in the country, which is great. 07:51 Yeah. 07:51 It's, it's yeah. 07:53 It's been a great thing. 07:54 I, you know, I, it, it was due to a partnership with the SEIU. 08:01 Not all of those have gone well in states, but in Oregon it, it went incredibly well. 08:07 Both the providers and the SEIU together were able to get really good results and, 08:13 and a reimbursement system that's in statute, which I, 08:17 as I travelled the world, as the AHCA board chair 08:21 it was always amazing to me and how few of the reimbursement systems are in 08:25 statute so that they require funding. 08:27 And that, that and the way that we created a system 08:32 that was rebased on the the 65th percentile of all the cost reports in the 08:39 state, it it made sure that 65% were fully 08:44 funded and the 35% didn't get full funding. 08:48 And so it incentive deficiency as well. 08:50 But it, it's created a lot of predictability for 08:53 our sector because we know we're going to get that our rates are going to reflect 08:59 the anything that we add to cost in our facilities. 09:04 Phil, when somebody looks at a person like you, 09:06 you've succeeded on every level. 09:08 I mean, when we look at your business, you've got these 26 in that range 09:13 facilities doing great. 09:15 You've created all these ancillary companies you at now actually have your 09:20 own ISNP. 09:21 You've got a pharmacy, you've got rehab. 09:24 It just, it really feels like everything that 09:26 you've done is that you, you were a leader in technology, 09:28 I think created a company. 09:30 What, what is your leadership philosophy? 09:33 If, if, if people are going to want to know and 09:35 want to know how, how did Phil do that? 09:38 What can I learn from Phil? 09:39 What, what is your, what is your overall leadership 09:41 philosophy? 09:43 Well, you know, I, I think that people need to be in this 09:47 profession for the right reasons. 09:50 You often see people get in and out quick and, and, you know, I, 09:54 I guess I am judging. 09:56 I'm just going to say I'm not judging. 09:57 But you know, when it's all about the margin or the 10:01 profit, I don't think it's good for this sector. 10:04 And so I think that my philosophy would be that, you know, 10:07 it starts with a passion for the people that we serve. 10:10 And it has to be sincere. 10:13 And you have to have a passion for the staff, providing the services and, 10:18 and really want to lead a team of people to achieve, you know, 10:23 great things and meet your objectives. 10:27 You've got to love getting results through through the people. 10:31 And I would say then just having the grit to get through all of the changes that 10:37 occur in this profession, whether they're reimbursement or 10:41 regulatory, there's constant things happening that if 10:45 you don't have that passion for the staff, you don't have that passion for the, 10:51 the residents and patients we serve, you're going to throw your hands up and 10:57 say, I'm, I'm done. 10:58 And I, I think, you know, one of the things that makes me sad about 11:03 COVID is so many quality operators who had the passion, 11:06 just got so whipped by COVID that I think they just got too tired. 11:11 They've been doing it for so many years now that they said I'm, 11:14 I'm not going to do it anymore. 11:15 So, but but yeah, I, I think it's got to start with that, 11:19 you know, after that, you know, this, this could be two hours as you know, Mark, 11:24 but you know, it's not what you do, but how you do what you do. 11:29 I think in no matter what business that you're in, 11:31 that that just becomes incredibly important. 11:34 And I would tell you that focusing on mission and purpose and our profession is 11:43 just absolutely critical because our workforce can get jobs. 11:49 A lot of our entry level workforce can get jobs in a number of environments. 11:53 And if we defined our purpose and our mission around passing surveys or 11:58 regulatory compliance, we're really cheating our staff and 12:03 ourselves of the thing that is so cool, which is to really make a difference in 12:09 people's lives. 12:10 Yeah, well, let me that that actually leads to me to 12:12 where I wanted to get to next. 12:14 Because when when we wrote the book and the chapter on Marquis, 12:17 I put out four reasons that I've, you know, 12:20 haven't spent years with you and then some time with your team. 12:24 Four reasons that I felt like you had succeeded. 12:27 And let's talk a little bit about each of those four reasons, 12:29 because the first is mission, which you you just mentioned, 12:32 you have a beautiful mission statement that I think has evolved over the years. 12:35 I feels like the book Being Mortal really, really helped you, you know, 12:41 crystallize your mission. 12:43 So tell us about your mission statement and the impact that it has on your 12:46 success. 12:47 Yeah. 12:48 So Being Mortal, if if people have not read that book, 12:53 they absolutely need to read the book. 12:56 It's just a, it did help define that our philosophy. 13:01 And I think that for us, it was understanding the idea of aging 13:05 decline and in the population that we're serving. 13:09 And for us, you know, we want to optimize and promote people's 13:14 vitality and to help them live the best rest of their lives, 13:18 no matter where they're at in their aging journey, their personal aging journey. 13:25 And I'm jumping in here, but that's a beautiful mission statement, 13:28 giving people vitality and letting them live the best rest of their lives, 13:31 whether it's one day, one year, week, one month, one year. 13:34 That's right. 13:34 And that is a compelling statement. 13:37 And that's the key. 13:38 And I, I really just feel like that if you can 13:41 live that you can the staff become advocates, you know, and I think that, 13:47 you know, I'm going through, you know, I went through a tough three-year decline 13:52 and my mother passing a few years ago. 13:55 Now I'm dealing with it with my in laws and all across the healthcare system, 14:00 you see people doing things that aren't necessarily in the person's best interest. 14:05 It's in the economic interest of the healthcare provider. 14:08 And I think for us, it's like, you know, at every step of that journey that we're 14:13 helping them, whether it's, you know, growing into assisted living or 14:18 independent transitioning care into skilled or post acute care episode or 14:23 transition into Hospice or at the very end of life. 14:27 You know, we need to be there to help that family 14:30 and get make sure they've got the resources and get the right services and 14:34 support at the right time. 14:35 And, and you know, I think everybody on this podcast will 14:39 understand what those mean. 14:41 But if if we don't do it, it's unlikely others will, you know, well, 14:47 you're certainly a mission driven organization. 14:52 The second thing that we listed in the book was an investment in leadership. 14:56 And I think again, you've been influenced by another book, 14:59 which was Outliers that developed this idea of I think the 10, 15:03 000 hour rule that you've sort of adopted. 15:06 Tell tell us about your investment in leadership. 15:08 Yeah, well, to your point, in the late 90s, 15:12 I was training AITs and and I, you know, I was losing about half of them. 15:18 So I'd get them straight out of college, put them through six months AIT and then 15:23 half would make it and half would fail. 15:26 And and that's when I read Outliers and and got this concept of the 10, 15:32 000 hours rules. 15:34 And I started thinking, you know, some of the people that didn't make it 15:38 with us later were successful in other organizations and maybe where the problem, 15:44 you know, maybe they needed more experience and 15:47 knowledge. 15:48 And then I started going back and looking at some of the leaders who had been 15:52 highly successful. 15:53 And I realized, well, they grew up in this environment or they 15:57 were working in high school or in college in a facility and then they went into the 16:03 leadership training. 16:04 And so from that experience, we as a team developed a, 16:08 a process where we bring in, we'll bring people in in high school, 16:12 but formally we'll start internships in college so they can work 2 to 3 summers 16:17 with us and start their journey and their hours. 16:21 And then we require after college, they spent three years during staffing, 16:27 doing admissions and during social services. 16:31 And by the time they get done with that three years, 16:34 then we know that they've got the leadership capabilities and attributes 16:38 that are going to help them be successful. 16:41 And and it's at that point we take the risk to really invest in the AIT program 16:46 with them. 16:48 Not everybody does. 16:49 But now we have a 95% success rate with the people we train because we know they 16:55 can do it. 16:57 But if I think Mark, you've seen when you come out here, 17:00 if they don't get put into an AIT program, we move them into other parts of the 17:06 organization. 17:07 So it's it's not waste of time for them and or us they've gotten exposure that's 17:11 incredibly valuable. 17:13 We just, we just try to really put them in the 17:15 right seat in the bus based on their talents and skills and all. 17:19 Yeah, I mean that that's very different than a 17:21 lot of companies which are just hiring AITs off the street, 17:24 putting them in buildings and within six months they're administrators. 17:28 Typically at Marquis we're talking about a 2, 3, 17:31 4 year process to become an administrator. 17:35 Takes a lot of discipline on your part, also takes a lot of discipline on the 17:38 person's part. 17:39 But then you end up you know what you got and obviously it's work. 17:44 So in the book, and we won't touch on these too much 17:46 because I want to cover some other areas, but we also talked about the discipline 17:49 that you have and making new investments. 17:52 We talked about your embracing technology, which everybody seems to be embracing now, 17:56 but before it was fashionable, you were way ahead of the curve on EMR 18:00 and developing tools and all of that. 18:03 Again, we won't focus on this too much today 18:05 because just in the interest of time, but people can read about them in the 18:08 book that we put out. 18:10 Let's talk about strategic planning because when I said you made an enormous 18:15 difference on the sector, you really changed the strategic planning 18:19 process at AHCA. 18:20 And I'll just tell a short story about this. 18:22 You've been on the board for a couple of years and we had and it was, it was me. 18:27 We had a very weak strategic planning process, 18:29 something that I just sort of made-up and there was no process to it at all. 18:35 And you came up to me one day after a meeting and you said, Mark, 18:38 I think you're a really good leader, but I don't think your strategic planning 18:43 process matches your leadership skills, which was just a very political way of 18:47 saying you, your, your strategic planning process really 18:51 sucks. 18:52 But I was touched by how, you know, politically you'd put it. 18:55 So we turned it over to you. 18:57 I said, well, what we should we be doing. 18:59 And you, you showed us the way and it changed 19:02 AHCA. You have maybe more than any company that 19:05 I've encountered in the space, just a very rigorous process for 19:09 strategic planning that it feels to me like has resulted in a lot of really good 19:15 decisions. 19:15 So it can you can you sort of briefly outline what you do? 19:19 Yeah. 19:20 And it by the way, I've stolen our process from four or five 19:25 systems and experiences that I've had. 19:28 I mean, Jeff Call, you know, there's a number of different people and 19:32 organizations over the years and I've kind of made it fit for our team. 19:38 I would just say that simply going through an annual strategic planning 19:44 process alone and being disciplined about it is important. 19:49 And I, I'm shocked by how many organizations do 19:52 not do that. 19:56 I We start by looking at the landscape and we're looking for driving forces that 20:02 are going to influence our our future and, and try to understand whether there are 20:09 threats. 20:10 Or opportunities or both. 20:14 And if there are threats we try to get an understanding of, could this kill us? 20:19 Which by the way, is a Michael Wally, like Michael Wally, the statement I, 20:25 I stole from him, does it hurt us or does it do no harm? 20:30 And those start to get us a sense and then we do, we have control. 20:35 So we basically get a sense for what are those driving forces, 20:41 are they current or emerging? 20:44 And, and what is the threat level? 20:47 And, and we get a list of the things that we 20:50 need to respond to, We need to plan around. 20:53 And, and, and that's what we do next is we set our 20:57 goals and our objectives and develop our strategies to address those, 21:03 address those areas. 21:05 There's other parts of our strategic planning like competitive analysis and 21:10 making sure that we're differentiating in the marketplace. 21:15 But I would suggest that that the competitive analysis and making sure that 21:21 again, you are in a good position there and the 21:24 looking at the driving forces are the two most important things so you don't get 21:30 caught up about, you know, on, on things. 21:34 I'll give you an example though, of something that we missed in the rehab 21:40 part of our company. 21:42 When we had PDPM I didn't we didn't think about the threat to the rehab business 21:49 that PDPM would have when when the government said there's no minute 21:54 requirements anymore and not not having a minute requirement threshold change that 22:01 business way more materially than than we realized it was going to. 22:07 And, and over the years we've missed a few, 22:10 but most of them we've caught, you know, most of them we've thought about, 22:14 planned around and we've turned a threat into opportunity. 22:18 Yeah, yeah, 'cause it really, and this would take a long time to 22:22 explain, more so than any provider that I know. 22:25 Your current business is, is has created insurance around a whole 22:30 bunch. 22:31 There's a lot of negative scenarios that could occur and you guys would still be 22:34 fine. 22:35 And I think a lot of that's because of your strategic planning. 22:39 Another thing I want to cover. 22:40 I'll go ahead. 22:41 No, no, I mean, I appreciate that. 22:43 I, you know, I would just say all of the, you know, 22:47 in the beginning we added ancillary services and new services either for some 22:52 specific strategic reason or because we needed an economic letter because the 22:58 facilities weren't doing well. 23:00 And now what we have is a collective network of services for seniors that are 23:08 in long term care or post acute care. 23:11 And they're all a part of one network on one platform, 23:15 one technology solution that enables us to manage the population of the people in 23:21 facilities, whether it's our facilities or our 23:24 customers facilities. 23:25 And you know, sometimes you got to just take risks and 23:28 do things and it comes together later. 23:31 You know, I think that's what happened in our case 23:34 is what was started for one reason turned out to enable us to be able to have this 23:39 big competitive advantage by having a network of these services. 23:44 Switching gears a little bit, I once asked you to help me understand 23:48 your success and you said one of the reasons was that we have a willingness to 23:51 admit that we suck at things. 23:53 So talk, talk about that. 23:57 Yeah. 23:57 I think I've just really wanted to create an environment where people could be 24:03 really honest. 24:04 You know, I see organizations, whether senior housing or, 24:09 or long term care, that they always just think they're the 24:14 best at everything and, and they're very inward. 24:19 And, and my dad actually may have helped me 24:21 with this philosophy because he talked about when he was a small independent or 24:25 had a couple of buildings, you know, he always thought that multis were the 24:29 bad guys and the independence for the, you know, 24:32 righteous people and that they did it the best and he assumed everything he did was 24:36 the best. 24:38 Well, then when he grew the company, there became this realization that the 24:43 great thing about being a multi is that you get to fail faster and you get to 24:48 trial things in 1 or 2, 3 facilities and figure out what gets the 24:53 best outcomes, what gets the best results. 24:56 And then you can deploy that best practice across all of the, 24:59 all of the buildings. 25:01 And I think again, for me, I took that and, 25:04 and we pushed it to creating an environment where we just need to 25:08 honestly be able to say we suck at this. 25:11 I want it to be OK. 25:13 And then let's have a, let's have an objective dialogue about 25:17 how do we not do poorly in this area in the future. 25:21 So, but I, but I think it's the hubris of 25:24 organizations sometimes that, you know, I, I brag about stealing from people. 25:29 I mean the best practices that, you know, providers have. 25:34 I think that was one of the great advantages of being involved with AHCA, 25:37 whether on the board or board chair or just involved, 25:40 is being able to sit around a table of people and hear other people's great 25:44 ideas. 25:44 You know, Glenn Van Ekeren's organization and all 25:47 the great providers being able to, you know, hear what they have. 25:51 I I have a we have a new chapters program, which is like make a wish for our 25:55 residents and it's an aspirational program. 25:58 It reinforces meaning and purpose for our staff. 26:02 I stole that from Genesis in in 1999. 26:07 They called it something else, but I took it from Genesis. 26:09 And so anyway, it, that all goes along with that philosophy. 26:12 Yeah. 26:13 So to to go to stuff that people can copy. 26:16 What if, if you were, what is the one or thing that you're 26:19 doing that you're surprised that other people aren't doing and you've already 26:23 talked about strategic planning. 26:25 Is there something else that you're doing that you think, man, 26:27 other people ought to be doing this? 26:29 Well, I think there's a few. 26:31 I, I would say the leaders, the investment in leadership, 26:36 I think is in our space. 26:38 We are people business and the people have to come first. 26:41 And if you don't get the right leaders, it doesn't matter how good of a CEO or a 26:46 COO you are, you're only as good as the administrator 26:49 facility and how they lead that team and make choices in that facility because 26:54 they're driving the culture there. 26:56 And so the investment in the leadership I think is absolutely critical. 27:04 Besides the strategic planning, you know, a lot of providers get undercapitalized 27:10 and, and I would say being disciplined 27:13 financially, not only with your acquisitions, 27:16 but making sure that you're capitalized so that you have the tolerance for 27:22 changes in reimbursement system, you have the tolerance for unforeseen 27:28 things. 27:29 I, I just, it's, there's nothing worse in our profession 27:32 than providers who are breaking even, not generating positive cash flow, 27:37 having to cut just to make it month to month, 27:40 that that's just a dangerous scenario. 27:43 And it's not, it's not good for any anyone. 27:46 So and then and, and again, innovation and, and adapting and, 27:51 and by the way, innovation isn't just technology to me, 27:55 it's just new systems and processes doing, just always trying to get better. 28:02 And, you know, you probably heard my Pat Riley quote of 28:04 if you're not getting better, you're getting worse. 28:07 And I, you know, that's just always trying to do just a 28:11 little bit better incrementally. 28:13 And those are kind of my probably the big ones. Phil, 28:17 you could have sold your real estate, maintained your operating company and 28:22 probably personally deposited a couple $100 million, maybe more. 28:27 You could probably sell your business right now for in the hundreds of millions 28:30 of dollars with all the ancillaries maybe in the upper hundreds of millions of 28:33 dollars. 28:34 How come you haven't done either of those things? 28:37 Yeah, well, number one, I enjoy what we do, you know, and and I, 28:42 I probably shared with you, but I'm concerned it wouldn't be good for 28:48 my health span. 28:50 So some of it's just selfish, you know, I, I think Phil needs a reason to get up in 28:55 the morning and and have something to do. 28:57 I don't think it would be good for my marriage if I wasn't going to work every 29:01 day. 29:02 So I think that that probably is high up there. 29:08 I think when you've developed an organization and you know what I'm 29:13 talking about that is a reflection of your values and your choices, 29:17 it's it's hard to give that that up. 29:19 And it's something I'm very proud of. 29:21 It's something I enjoy. 29:23 And I think what makes it most easy to, to just keep going is just having really 29:28 strong leaders across the organization that are what I call next generation 29:33 leaders who I'm really comfortable the way they make choices and they're 29:38 consistent. 29:39 And, and I and when I see the staff that they 29:44 lead very happy and comfortable that the choices of the last 37 years could go on 29:51 another 30, it it gives me the confidence to move on. 29:56 There are days when I wonder if I'm the crazy one. 29:59 I'm sure probably am. 30:00 But but everybody else in New Oregon sold, right? 30:04 Yeah, exactly. 30:05 I mean, I think I'm the last one standing. 30:07 But but yeah, it I think those are the, you know, those are the primary reasons. 30:14 Well, I mean, the really, the really great end of this is that 30:16 you're the 4th generation, but there's a 5th generation. 30:19 There's a couple of fogs running around that have key roles at Marquis and it 30:24 looks like might be able to lead you into the next 37 years. 30:27 Tell us about that. 30:29 Yeah, I, I mean, my youngest son is our vice president of 30:33 operations and again, has really turned into a really strong 30:37 leader and other son who's license, who's the license administrator. 30:43 But you know, you know, Mark, I think I think you know this, 30:47 but when I left Prestige, the advantage of it was I got out of a 30:52 family business and I didn't have to deal with family dynamics. 30:56 And then after 37 years, I'm right back into a family business. 31:01 And it's not just my kids, it's all of my leaders and team members 31:04 who've worked with us for long periods of time who have their kids here. 31:09 And I don't know how many second generations we've got, you know, 31:13 in our company, I'll bet it's 30 at least. 31:17 And so there's a whole other generation here of, of of kids. 31:22 So, yeah. 31:24 So I went back into family business. 31:26 Yeah. 31:26 Well, you probably already told us with your 31:28 answer that you're that you haven't sold what, 31:31 where do you see the future of the of Marquis and of the space generally? 31:35 Yeah, I, you know, the demographics create a lot of optimism, 31:40 especially in the skilled sector where CMS is not going to be, you know, 31:46 driving some massive expansion of skilled nursing facility bed capacity. 31:53 That should increase occupancies. 31:55 It should increase negotiating power because access will become an issue. 31:59 So I'm hoping that states will be able to, or will be able to be more effective in 32:05 negotiating very good Medicaid rates in states that don't have good rates today. 32:11 So I, I think that, you know, those are the positives. 32:14 The challenges though, are going to be workforce. 32:19 We're going to have the, you know, the, you and I have talked about this, but the, 32:25 the amount of babies being born now is like 1.7 per, you know, a couple, 32:30 it needs to be 2. 2 just to keep up with the death rates. 32:35 And so we're going to have a, a workforce challenge that will continue. 32:41 And so hopefully we can do the things that are necessary. 32:45 This administration's been a little tough because they've cut back on immigration 32:49 and that's probably the easiest solution to our workforce challenges for, 32:54 for anything in healthcare. 32:57 And then I, I worry about the national debt, 33:01 I worry about the stress on the national budget and the interest load of that debt 33:08 and how it could affect the entitlement programs and the funding for each blind 33:15 and disabled. 33:16 So there's it, it, it's just going to be really interesting. 33:19 And I, I guess I would just say because you know 33:22 this better than anybody, politics and the ability to advocate and 33:26 get results in DC and in state capitals. 33:30 Is it going to become less important? 33:31 It's going to become more important over the next 15 or 20 years. 33:37 And as you know, both parties that, you know, 33:40 they create their own opportunities and their own threats. 33:44 And, and so I, I, I think what our future looks like is 33:49 going to be a function of how we navigate through that those political waters. 33:56 Yeah. 33:57 Well, Phil, thanks so much for spending time with us 33:59 today. 34:00 I think anybody that's watched this understands the great success that you've 34:03 had and we really appreciate everything you've done at Marquis, 34:05 everything you've done for the sector and joining us today. 34:08 Thanks a lot. 34:08 Thanks, Mark, and same to you. 34:10 And thanks again to First Quality for sponsoring this segment and making these 34:15 segments hassle free, no pop ups and all the other good stuff. 34:20 And thanks for your support at Park Place. 34:21 We wouldn't be able to run things like this without you and we really appreciate 34:25 it and wish you continued success.
